I’m ANGRY about the Blue Origin and Dynetics protests against the SpaceX HLS award! (Find out why)



The Angry Astronaut gets angry about the BO and Dynetics protests…but he’s REALLY angry at someone else!

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BO Protest
https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.spaceref.com/news/2021/BlueOriginProtest.pdf

Original NASA Analysis
https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/atoms/files/option-a-source-selection-statement-final.pdf

An interesting way at looking at this problem…
https://washingtontechnology.com/blogs/editors-notebook/2021/04/nasa-lunar-protest.aspx .

48 comments
  1. Another point IMHO: the Dynetics system is easily expandable. Just add a hatch on the rear and connect an exact copy of the lander there – voilá: twice the volume, a redundant exit hatch (or maybe a garage for a rover) and separate airtight compartment for safety.

    And in fact NASA already has experience with a similar design: it's basically the same as the Mars lander's skycrane – and that worked exceptionally well as we know. The hole thing could be made even more modular, by designing the tank/propulsion "cradle" as an independent structure, that can land interchangeable crew/cargo/garage/tank/whatever modules and even leave them behind on the surface – the first step to building an outpost.

  2. I dont buy "price wasn't emphasized as critical point" as valid. The entire point of having an open bid is to have prices as low as possible. I'd argue the common interpretation of what a bid is should be more then sufficient.

  3. From the door to the ground, spacex ladder is anywhere from 130ft to 140ft, and since they didn’t find a way to get the crew out through the engine bay, they will have to use an electric winch, or have up to a 140 ft ladder just to reach the ground.

  4. The Angry astronauts describes dynetics refueling as if it won't require exactly the same thing the lunar starship will require: refueling. He implies its inherent that the lunar starship must return to leo to be refueled rather than have a tanker come to it in lunar orbit; but its the exact same scenario for the Dynetics lander, it needs to be fueled up in lunar or leo.

  5. How could Dynetics pass Preliminary Design Review and also have the critical mass overage? Proposals and Continuation Review (CR) were submitted/conducted in December 2020. NASA's evaluation was based entirely on those products. PDR was conducted by Dynetics in February 2021. Not considered in the evaluation.

  6. Blue Origin can't even orbit the Earth and wants 5x the amount of money SpaceX asked for, and they still think they deserve a contract, lmao.

  7. I think Starship is the least feasible way to go to the moon because of the amount of launches required to refuel it in space…

  8. It really boils down to this. SpaceX is already delivering NASA astronauts to Earth orbit. Bezos can't get ANYTHING to orbit! End of bidding process, right there. Bezos needs to STFU until he has a proven track record.

  9. Well, NASA can either hurry up or just stop blocking CNSA from international space cooperation. Or else be left alone by every other space agency as they are forced to choose between NASA or CNSA, this would be a sad no-more-NASA scenario.

    Aditional problem that none of this depends on NASA 🙁

  10. Sorry, but no. It's not a good point that NASA didn't specify that "price is king". When you tender for a project, you know very well that price is a concern, and a major one. If given two technically feasible options, then price is the only real remaining determinand, and the National Team would have known that too. It is not a reasonable objection.

  11. If you want to go offroading do you pay to have a vehicle built from scratch or do you buy an existing vehicle and modifyit to suit your needs. Starship has been under production as a prototype for a while and can be modified for lunar landing. The other two landers look lazy to me… like they took the design of the Apollo lander and did slight redesigns and resizing

  12. bezos is always about the money. he wipes out other business by subsidizing amazon with the web service company. amazon as a whole makes 5 % profit the AWS division makes 25%. that's why he was so pissed when the pentagon dumped his award and gave it to microsoft.
    i bet his new proposal would have been almost free just to get it. also it would involve a bunch of partners in other states . so the politicians aren't happy either. to them the more states the better which is the opposite of reality for the taxpayers. look at sls . it was designed as a make work from day1 and if not for spacesx would still be nowhere , not that it really is anywhere yet.

  13. i think the whole project will get cancelled anyway . not enough people care about going to the moon. it ain't woke.

  14. At first they were against him because it can't be done. Now they are against him because he is getting it done.
    Bozo is showing its true colours as a bully and a child having a temper tantrum.
    I hope Elon gets EVERYTHING done that he has planned. 🙂

  15. you got no business, "out in the solar system." the answers to our issues are not out there somewhere. in consideration of everything – it seems moronic to be designing anything but antigrav and good solar cells.

  16. Boeing had buggy ass spacecraft software and they tried to cover it up and these cover ups potentially could kill astronauts. And boeing costs too much.
    Dynetics tech docs for their lander had the smell of bovine fecal matter (lies and exaggerated or made-up numbers)
    Not disclosed in NASA document – In addition to money, NASA chose with the raving reviews by the astronauts that rode on Falcon 9 and Dragon

  17. Just wait until China erects a base on the Moon, only then will the US and other western governments care about funding a lunar base.

  18. The problem is the American people didn’t bug their representatives to fully fund NASA I bugged my congressman. You should urge your viewers to bug their representatives

  19. Why would lunar refueling be so difficult for Starship? Delta v from lunar orbit and back is small compared to to round trip from LEO? The energy needed to lift fuel from LEO is the same whether in a tanker or a refueled Lunar starship. Further, a starship tanker could aerobrake on the return to Earth since it will land to refill anyway.

  20. Why don't Blue Origin's, Dynetics, and SpaceX just pull their money in work together… It isn't like space exploration is a very lucrative venture, it makes sense to work together on this as much as possible if they want real results trying to be competitive in this market is just unnecessary.

  21. If it takes 10 – 20 launches to fuel one starship mission like your other vid said, and their most reused booster to date has flown 9 times is it really going to be a reusable mission?

  22. "A monopoly on landing on the moon". Uhh…last I checked, nobody has landed on the moon in 50 years, so someone will have a monopoly on it at first. Obviously the SpaceX solution, IF IT WORKS, is by far the best solution on every level. It's not even close. It's much more capable, cheaper, doesn't rely on SLS, which is an expensive, underpowered, debacle.

  23. What do you think BO should do to become competitive with SpaceX? Do you think they should step back and focus on making one very good part of a rocket and try to sell to other companies? Or do you think their only hope it's too fake it till they make it and hope their engineers will eventually design and build a better rocket for cheaper?

  24. I bet BO would still be unhappy if NASA said they'd take half the money they were going to give to SpaceX and give it to them so they had equal funding. SpaceX can do a lot with that money while BO would only be able to pay for a year of ULA staff wages. Unless they convince the government to give enough money to NASA to also fund them, it's a moot point. They can afford SpaceX who is also the best by far, and BO will likely not build something before the lunar starship is finished. So they should know they are at best competing for second place, the amount of funding they would need to become competitive with SpaceX would be staggering and a lot more than what they'd get from the NASA contract even if they got the full amount they wanted and SpaceX got nothing. Since Bezos is an engineer, I am astonished at how brazenly he shows he cares more about nudging businesses to build incrementally better rockets and tries to get the government to throw money at the problem instead of just trying to build a better rocket. I don't expect him to work with engineers like Musk does, but he should at least tell his engineers to focus on building a better rocket. SpaceX is probably going to have fully stacked starships flying to Mars before they even start construction on New Glenn, and I doubt they'll be much cheaper than what's currently available. Every spat he gets into with SpaceX comes down to "It's anticompetitive because I can't do that yet at all/cheaply, I promise I can do it eventually, just give me a ton of money/satellite space now and don't let SpaceX have any. Because if they do they'll still outcompete me." He seems to want to take the same approach as amazon and try to gain a monopoly on customers at any cost (even if it's the government's). I don't understand what game he thinks he's playing.

  25. Don't worry, SpaceX organized a Private Crew for Dragon Missions and will do the same for Starship. The funding will be secured by Starlink Internet Broadband Services so there is no shortage of Money everything Starship. It will fly – with Nasa or without it.

  26. HLS exists entirely to fund the manufacturers. It offers little more than a Saturn V, it’s always behind schedule and costs are humongous.

  27. Only one bidder had working low cost launch systems capable of carrying people. Only one bidder had a realistic path to landing on the moon. It’s no surprise that bidder got the deal.

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